Jan Vertonghen: Page 5 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Jan Vertonghen

Mirth

y va marquer wrote:
Why would he sign a defender if he wants to reshape midfield?
Could he not just sign a midfielder? M'vila perhaps?

Petit came in as a defender, didn't he? Gilberto was a CB until the season before WC '02.

I doubt managers look at favoured positions at all when scouting a player, rather focus on their skills and whether they can be translated across.

Although I'll take Rex's word on his lack of ability in midfield, and I can't see Wenger ever signing a midfielder who isn't good at passing the ball around.

Mirth

Although if we're talking about the defence being crowded, the midfield has plenty of bodies in there as well.

I wouldn't complain if our entire transfer budget was spent on strengthening the front three.

spacemanspiff

Where would we play him? I don't 'get' this signing, although I'm not complaining.

Rex

General Mirth wrote:
Although if we're talking about the defence being crowded, the midfield has plenty of bodies in there as well.

I wouldn't complain if our entire transfer budget was spent on strengthening the front three.

Me either. Spunk it all on 2 top class players I say. One more a midfield type player who can play wide and in an attacking role centrally, and the other on a forward who can play both wide and as an out and out CF.

Burnwinter

The question is, has our defence conceded too many goals due to bodies in the squad, tactics or quality?

I say the 39 against to date stem from:

Fuck all specialist fullbacks in the early part of the season (or dubious / inexperienced ones like Jenkinson, Gibbs and Traore)
Poor defending from the front in some cases (hello Arshavin)
The continuation of the high line concurrent with the deterioration of our possession game following the departure of Nasri and Fabregas
Injured CBs as well (Vermaelen who barely kicked a ball in eighteen months)
General lack of cohesion in the squad (mostly solved now after bedding down)

To solve those problems I'd

Make sure all four of Sagna, Santos, Gibbs and Jenkinson are fit at season's start
Make sure all four of Vermaelen, Koscielny, Mertesacker and Djourou are fit at season's start
Invest only in midfielders and forwards who are
- hardworking in defence
- able to play a possession game / retain the ball / choose correct options

If one of our eight defenders isn't going to be fit at the start of the season, or is out without a return date, then Vertonghen might make sense. Otherwise I can't see the advantage vs the option of signing front six players - including perhaps a DM - who can press and retain the ball effectively.

Either way if our first choice defence is fit on day one we'll be far better off than we have been.

Rex

Mertesacker is running again. Seems he may even make the Euros.
If this was Thiago Silva then hell yes! But it is Vertonghen. Good player, but will only give us more strength in depth IMO.

lorddulaarsenal

not seen him play then rex?

Captain

We have these conversations whenever we sign anybody. I remember a long thread on A-M about Sagna's signing because we already had Eboue, we shouldn't have signed Adebayor because he was a bean pole who couldn't score, Chamberlain was a waste of money, Vermaelen was unheard of and an average left back from a weak league, Koscielny, Santos and so on.

Just let Wenger and the scouts do their stuff and be happy that we are strengthening if we sign him.

spacemanspiff

Yes but none of those players had question marks regarding where they would actually be playing (at least, I don't think so). Even with Vermaelen who was a LB at Ajax, there was no mystery that he would partner Gallas. I think Vertonghen's flexibility might actually be a hindrance to him, unless he's willing to be a utility player here instead of a first XI starter at an equally big club.

At CB (apparently his best position), we have 2 clear options ahead of him (as much as you don't rate Vermaelen he is clearly a massive leader and influential figure and isn't getting dropped) + a big German on big wages that we just signed last season and who started showing signs of being accustomed to our play before his big injury.

At LB, we have a Home Grown player that Wenger clearly rates, and Santos who we just signed.

At DM, well... the midfield is the big question mark going into next season.

Ray

Id be pretty chuffed if we signed vertonghen and podolski before the window was even open. Then we can concentrate on getting rid of the wage hoggers.

Clrnc

I will never complain about us signing quality squad depth if that doesn't compromise our attacking signings. Its always been my case. People keep saying Vertonghen is only decent but honestly he looks way better at Ajax than Vermaelen was at that same point. Nobody rated Vermaelen at all whatsoever but in his first match he impressed us already. Lets trust Arsene shall we?

A little weird to see both Vertonghen and M'Vila linked with us. One must surely be fake. We won't sign both. It would be very weird if we does

Burnwinter

@[deleted] fair enough

Still never going to be the determining factor in a defensive improvement next season.

Cill

If this deal was done with money left over after we'd strengthend our foward line an midfield it'd be decent for sub 10M. But as one of our big buys, no.

CB: Koscielny, Vermaelen, Mertesacker, Djourou, Bartley/Miquel and probably even Squillaci when no-one will take on his high wages will be there next year.
LB: Santos and Gibbs. Yes we got stuck there this year but pointless for him to be signed for here, especially when Verm and Coq can both deputise too.
DM: Song, Arteta, Jack, Coq, Frimpong. Stacked.

Unless we're going to lose players from above I can't see the point in Vertonghen tbh. Or M'Vila. Unless they're picked up after we've done the rest of our business.

Ricky1985

John Carter wrote:
http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/transfer-news/Transfer-gossip-Arsenal-want-Jan-Vertonghen-Ajax-and-Belgium-defender-in-early-summer-will-make-7m-move-article883779.html

£7m? Bloody hell. If that's even close then bring him in.

I thought he'd cost a lot more than that. Must be entering into the last year of his contract?

lorddulaarsenal

yep he is

y va marquer

General Mirth wrote:
Petit came in as a defender, didn't he? Gilberto was a CB until the season before WC '02.

I doubt managers look at favoured positions at all when scouting a player, rather focus on their skills and whether they can be translated across.

Although I'll take Rex's word on his lack of ability in midfield, and I can't see Wenger ever signing a midfielder who isn't good at passing the ball around.

Do people believe this is the plan for Vertonghen because they feel we don't need another decent defender and this idea of playing him in a DM role explains why we may be interested?

Or have people actually watched him play and thought he's wasted in defence, he's got what it takes to play in MF?

Personally I don't have any issue at all with him being signed primarily to play in our back four.

If we're going for a midfielder I'd prefer one of the physically commanding attacks with vision variety.

Captain

Plays there regularly for Belgium.

Personally, I think we would be signing him primarily as a centrehalf.

Ricky1985

For me he's a centreback all day long. Although he is impressive on the ball for a guy his size, and hard to stop when he's in full-tilt as well.

Mirth

y va marquer wrote:
General Mirth wrote:
Petit came in as a defender, didn't he? Gilberto was a CB until the season before WC '02.

I doubt managers look at favoured positions at all when scouting a player, rather focus on their skills and whether they can be translated across.

Although I'll take Rex's word on his lack of ability in midfield, and I can't see Wenger ever signing a midfielder who isn't good at passing the ball around.

Do people believe this is the plan for Vertonghen because they feel we don't need another decent defender and this idea of playing him in a DM role explains why we may be interested?

Or have people actually watched him play and thought he's wasted in defence, he's got what it takes to play in MF?

Personally I don't have any issue at all with him being signed primarily to play in our back four.

If we're going for a midfielder I'd prefer one of the physically commanding attacks with vision variety.

I have no idea. I've probably only watched him a handful of times over the years and never paid much attention. I was just trying to see whether there's anything in this story per say rather than judge his ability. If we're looking for a midfield, he might be an option but otherwise this seems weird.

I don't want to comment on his quality because, frankly, our scouts are much better equipped and while I clearly blow you all away with my clever insight into European football, I'm not as qualified as Steve Rowley. Yet.

I'd love to have him though, but I was excited when we signed Park just because he was all new and shiny.

Ricky1985

Frank de Boer:

“He is perhaps the best player in the league (Dutch Eredivisie) at the moment. With his power, passing, positional sense, pace and ability to score goals, there’s no one better.”

The great Johan Cruyff also apparently named him as his favourite Ajax player and recommended him to Barcelona.

Maybe Djourou's going to make room? Then this would make a lot of sense.

JUVENTUS INTERESTED IN ARSENAL'S JOHAN DJOUROU

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