Brentford at home at 5.30: Page 7 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Brentford at home at 5.30

Dom

Can't say I noticed Rice, Saliba, Saka, Martinelli and Partey taking it easy because of the upcoming CL tie. This performance was a carbon copy of several performances from the start and middle of the season that have left us with a points ceiling of 70 - 75. I can tolerate the ugly, predictable football if it's winning trophies though, so Arteta better deliver the league or CL this or next season.

Claudius

We held Brentford to basically the lowest xG conceded this season in the league. And they scored. A number of our games have been like that. Good control, great defending, but we got hurt on the margins because our team has scored over a dozen goals fewer than Liverpool. We just need to fix the front of our team - injuries don’t help.

Coombs

Claudius injuries don’t help

but were entirely predictable.

Tam

Claudius We held Brentford to basically the lowest xG conceded this season in the league. And they scored. A number of our games have been like that. Good control, great defending, but we got hurt on the margins because our team has scored over a dozen goals fewer than Liverpool.

I can't tell whether this is in relation to this game, the season in general, or applies to both.

We got caught with an overload, didn't stop the cross into the box, didn't defend the ball stood up to the back post, didn't pounce on the knock down, allowed Wissa to swivel and get a shot off without challenge. Not great defending at all.

When that becomes a trend, conceding consistently despite keeping teams to low xG generally or their lowest xG of the season, whichever stat you would like to pick, you've also got to look at that being a bit of a problem. I'm not overly concerned about it, because as you say, we have clear attacking improvements to make which should address some of those issues. But that being said, throwing in commentary about being hurt on the margins because we've scored less than Liverpool is avoiding the issue that we were 1-0 up and that should be sufficient to beat a bottom of the table team if we are as defensively sound as is being made out.

Claudius

Coombs Liverpool is injury free other than about 3 weeks of Konate out. Spurs, United and City are riddled with injuries.
Sorry, anybody who comes out and says that they can reliably predict injuries is being unrealistic. Last year we stayed largely healthy and avoided cluster injuries. This season we have had weeks when our 4 best attackers are all out simultaneously. That is NOT entirely predictable.

QuincyAbeyie

Claudius you speak in absolutes when it's not necessary. Whether it's predictable that our four best attackers would be out isn't relevant - what's relevant is whether it was predictable that we'd suffer enough injuries up front that a title push would suffer. It didn't take our four best attackers being out for that to happen.

Were we too short on quality up front when the window closed? Yes. So it was predictable that it wouldn't be enough.

Tam

Claudius Again, misrepresenting people's concerns. Nobody reliably predicted a cluster of injuries to key players at the same time. But many recognised we were lucky with injuries last year and concerns were raised at the outset of the season about an injury to the likes of Odegaard or Saka given their importance to the system, and relative lack of investment in the front line which has left us short of proven quality.

Given the heavy schedules those key players have had in recent years it is reasonable to take the view we would have picked up a worrying injury or two. Four, granted, is a blow and harder to foresee, but part of Arteta and the managements job is to make an assessment of the risk of instances like that and ensure we were prepared, and on that note I don't think they have come out of it looking good.

Qwiss

Claudius I thought we left ourselves short squadwise and I stick by that. That Partey has stayed fit is a miracle. We've other injury ridden players too who are out but I don't think anyone could have predicted the extent of our injuries. I think all things considered with the depth of our injury crisis we've coped well as a squad.

Now the big caveat here is that last summer wasn't enough and most of us knew that. Then add in that we knew we had serious injury issues and were chasing Liverpool in January it was a completely self inflicted wound not to strengthen the front line then.

Coombs

Claudius I predicted it, myself. Therefore, it is and was predictable.

Claudius

QuincyAbeyie Were we too short on quality up front when the window closed? Yes. So it was predictable that it wouldn't be enough.

Nobody has argued against this. This is a universally agreed issue. There are gaps at forward.

Claudius

Tam Again, misrepresenting people's concerns. Nobody reliably predicted a cluster of injuries to key players at the same time. But many recognised we were lucky with injuries last year and concerns were raised at the outset of the season about an injury to the likes of Odegaard or Saka given their importance to the system, and relative lack of investment in the front line which has left us short of proven quality.

Sorry due, @Coombs literally said we could've predicted the injuries. We fans tend to act like sports doctors and have very clear ideas of when individual players will be injured or when we will have cluster injuries, but it is highly unpredictable from the outside. Liverpool have been extremely healthy this season, despite playing as many games as this year. Their star player, Salah, has had 2 thirty day injury-induced breaks in the last 10 years. In the last 5 years he has started a minimum 31 games but just keeps going with big minutes at a high level of output, setting a record for G+A this season.

So I don't buy the idea that a massive injury crisis was predictable. Injuries happen. You can have no injuries, a few injuries, or a shit show of injuries. We probably had way way more than anyone would've reliably predicted.

Tam

Claudius There's nuance here that you seem to want to overlook.

Are we likely to get injured players throughout the course of the year? Absolutely that's why we have 20+ squads and not 11 first team players.

Can we reliably predict those injuries will all hit at the same period in the same area of the pitch? No - but that's not what Coombs was saying, despite it being the question you chose to answer.

I agree with Coombs - that we would experience injury is fairly predictable. Your oft quoted line on how Liverpool have no injuries, but City, United, Spurs et al do somewhat backs this up. At the same time I also agree with your point about it being difficult to foresee that we would experience such a level of injury concentrated in one area. Both can be true. The point is not about the injuries, it's about how poorly prepared we were for them.

Claudius

Qwiss Agreed with everything you've said.
Partey has been our saviour. Just hope he doesn't score the winning goal in the final in Munich. FML

RowJimmy

Wow.

Burnwinter

In retrospect we were slightly light up front any which way and with zero injuries all season. We knew this as we'd gone in fairly hard to sign Sesko.
An injury to Saka or Havertz was very predictable but on the other hand, on this basis Liverpool have had good luck.
The spate of forward injuries with Jesus, Saka, Martinelli and Havertz all out was very unlikely. But Jesus, Sterling and Trossard have all been shit any which way so let's not overcook it. We were and are short on quality and form, injuries or no injuries.
The good news is any forward signing truly on a level with Martinelli, Havertz and Saka will be a game-changer. Two such signings would be revolutionary.

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