Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?: Page 61 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?

Ray

Remains to be seen, but as it stands. Arteta delivered more than Emery did.

QuincyAbeyie

Based on your definition which somehow only takes the league into account if you win it because then it's a trophy?

Ray

Well there’s different levels with different achievements, winning the league, CL qualification, Europa league qualification, the rest doesn’t matter. Arteta achieved an FA cup and europa league qualification in his first season. Emery managed europa league qualification only.

jones

Alex McLeish Roberto di Matteo etc all won cups, they're not exactly indicative of managerial ability. Emery finished his first season with 70 points, Arteta is looking at probably mid 50 fucking points.

Clrnc

Arteta is doing a worse job than Emery. I think that is clear enough as of current circumstances.

But sacking Emery and appointing Arteta the right decision till at least end of this season for me.

goon

He's not talking about managerial ability though, he's talking about achievements, and winning an FA Cup and qualifying for the EL definitely ranks higher than finishing 5th and qualifying for the EL.

If we want to go into performance, the issue with Emery wasn't the first season, but how it ended and how the second one started, after two full transfer windows. By the time he was sacked, he was averaging 1.26 points per game from his last 19. Arteta is averaging 1.68 from the last 19, this is after one transfer window where his marquee signing has been injured throughout. Freddie managed 1 ppg from his 7 games in between.

Emery was in charge for 18 months, including two summer transfer windows after taking over a team in 6th. Arteta has been in charge for 16 months, 3 of which were spent in lockdown, virtually no pre-season and has had a single COVID orientated transfer window after taking over a team in 12th position.

So yeah, context matters.

goon

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11670/12276117/mikel-arteta-exclusive-interview-bukayo-saka-emile-smith-rowe-and-the-story-of-arsenals-youth-revolution

Big interview with Sky.

I do like the emphasis on youth, will be interesting to see if he puts his money where his mouth is and resists signing another striker if Laca leaves. Will require careful squad management if we want to keep a pathway open for the likes of Balogun, Azeez, Kido, Patino and Hutchinson.

AAStyle

All managers encountered the same context. If anything, you could say that chaos is a ladder: this was a good opportunity to clinch top4 (I am referring to the current season).

flobaba

There goes the fake news about how he doesn’t give youth a chance.

banduan

you have to go full gas in the first 30 min he says. Where the fuck was that most of the season then.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Yep that's when things just don't add up with Arteta.

Meatwad

he talks a good game, just doesn't know how to put his words into action yet.

JazzG

Winning the Europa cup gets him another season, otherwise we need to have a long hard think about where we are going under him. For all the positives I'd argue there have been more negatives.

Claudius

JazzG wrote:
Winning the Europa cup gets him another season, otherwise we need to have a long hard think about where we are going under him. For all the positives I'd argue there have been more negatives.

If we are 10th without a Europa title, that feels the responsible course of action. We are a big club and should only keep him if we are confident of trajectory. He has 2 months to firm up his position

But as Goon says, context matters

Bosscielny

jones wrote:
Claudius wrote:
There’s no way this is below Emery. The guy can actually construct a playing style. He’s struggling with consistency. Emery gave us nothing on that front.

The big obstacle for Arteta was he was clearly compromising his vision until around December. That’s a recruiting issue, not a head coach issue

Revisionism. Emery played with a style whether attractive or not and before unraveling was much more successful with it. Arteta has a worse record than Emery and that's after the catastrophic form that saw the latter sacked and after the "great" run after Christmas for Arteta. Not an opinion a fact. And what exactly is Artetas style looking at our last games? Sheffield, Slavia home and away, Liverpool and West Ham - you can barely tell it's the same club fielding a team let alone a distinct style.

What was Emery’s style? Go in at half time 0-0 then hope to out perform xG in the second half and squeeze out a one goal win? Sounds pretty familiar to me.

I’m not going to get into it too much, because he’s obviously going to be here next season and i’m excited for him to be here for it, but saying Arteta doesn’t have a style, and Emery did, is disingenuous.

We’ve played plenty of decent stuff when he’s been able to flesh out the front three behind the striker with attacking midfielders. The second ESR was considered fit enough to play, he was in the team. As soon as Odegaard was settled, he was in the team. Obviously he persevered with Willian for so long mostly because he hates the club and was more concerned with his ego than with results, but it’s pretty clear that he was also sort of, maybe hoping he’d be getting out of him what he’s getting of out of these 20 year olds that have kept him out of the team for the last 4 months.

Anytime we’ve had at least two of Saka, ESR and Ode we’ve been looking alright, and i wouldn’t be surprised if the numbers backed that up. That sort of stuff doesn’t matter when you’re TeNtH, which i can appreciate, but there’s still a lot left of the season and we’ve got a decent run in. I’m optimistic.

Alright. Turns out i didn’t mind getting into it.

Bosscielny

Clrnc wrote:
Arteta is doing a worse job than Emery. I think that is clear enough as of current circumstances.

Definitely. He’s clearly got results all over Arteta.

But not only that, I haven’t heard a single word about USB sticks or juice boxes since Mikel arrived. He seems to have ditched those team building exercises like “making fun of the coach behind his back” too. I can’t imagine how miserable morale around the place must be with the whole playing group being behind Arteta and his ideas. The last thing you want when you’re trying to turn the culture of anything around is the support and trust of those around you.

Claudius

Bosscielny wrote:
Clrnc wrote:
Arteta is doing a worse job than Emery. I think that is clear enough as of current circumstances.

Definitely. He’s clearly got results all over Arteta.

But not only that, I haven’t heard a single word about USB sticks or juice boxes since Mikel arrived. He seems to have ditched those team building exercises like “making fun of the coach behind his back” too. I can’t imagine how miserable morale around the place must be with the whole playing group being behind Arteta and his ideas. The last thing you want when you’re trying to turn the culture of anything around is the support and trust of those around you.

😆

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

😆

QuincyAbeyie

We've fallen so far that the manager is getting praise for letting the players drink juice.

Bosscielny

There you go again, not giving the manager any credit.

The poor guy goes out of his way to abolish the great juice prohibition of 2018 and you’re here treating it like some joke.

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