Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?: Page 239 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?

Ray

It’s hard to get behind the club, when the club isn’t doing it’s upmost to win.

Why should fans care if the actual owner doesn’t.

goon

Screw the owners, this is about your own enjoyment. It's 100% more fun to get behind that team than it is to be cynical, I mean that's the whole point isn't it? Sometimes the club makes it impossible, but right now that's definitely not the case. Even if you don't like Arteta, the team itself is the most likeable and exciting in years imo.

Ricky1985 wrote:
It seems the fans in the stadium are more invested in the team than for a very long time, and it's a beautiful thing when the Arsenal fan base online comes together to stand up to other clubs, unfair treatment and bullshit criticism.

The atmosphere in the stadium has been brilliant this season, even in games where the performances have been pretty drab. I'm addicted.

Clrnc

Ray wrote:
It’s hard to get behind the club, when the club isn’t doing it’s upmost to win.

Why should fans care if the actual owner doesn’t.

How is the owner not caring? He has given our manager almost a free reign, most resources any arsenal manager got in history. Whoever he want to cull we paid them off, whoever we wanted to buy even for big money he gave the greenlight. Really can't blame the ownership at all

AAStyle

Entrusting the club to a rookie manager and maintaining it after it has been clear that he is not up to the task for me is not giving a real sh*t about the club. Even if made with good faith, this decision can be attributed to ignorance or stupidity, and both are not acceptable.

Ray

Clrnc wrote:
Ray wrote:
It’s hard to get behind the club, when the club isn’t doing it’s upmost to win.

Why should fans care if the actual owner doesn’t.

How is the owner not caring? He has given our manager almost a free reign, most resources any arsenal manager got in history. Whoever he want to cull we paid them off, whoever we wanted to buy even for big money he gave the greenlight. Really can't blame the ownership at all

The fact that they've overseen the club to consecutive finishes at 8th, and still refused to make changes tells you all you need to know really.

Giving the manager free reign is the issue. And in terms of resources they have contributed but they can always do more.

RowJimmy

AAStyle- wrote:
Entrusting the club to a rookie manager and maintaining it after it has been clear that he is not up to the task for me is not giving a real sh*t about the club. Even if made with good faith, this decision can be attributed to ignorance or stupidity, and both are not acceptable.

No, they have made decisions you disagree with. We'll see who is right. But a big part of what you disagree with them about is the appropriate time frame for judging outcomes. I don't know that they're right, but I'm okay with their timeframe.

And enjoy yourself watching Arsenal occasionally. Try O'Hanlon's now that the Blind Pig is closed.

Clrnc

Ray wrote:
Clrnc wrote:
How is the owner not caring? He has given our manager almost a free reign, most resources any arsenal manager got in history. Whoever he want to cull we paid them off, whoever we wanted to buy even for big money he gave the greenlight. Really can't blame the ownership at all

The fact that they've overseen the club to consecutive finishes at 8th, and still refused to make changes tells you all you need to know really.

Giving the manager free reign is the issue. And in terms of resources they have contributed but they can always do more.

I agree that their blind faith might come to bite them back. But can't say they haven't backed our manager fully. In fact they over backed him, coming out their own resources quite a fair bit.

I mean, its either you go full buy in to the current manager or just chop and change again. The former might still work out.

I am not those toxic positivity kind of person and more of a realist, but even I can see the benefits and still holding out hope that we have a surprisingly good ending afterall.

FEBravo

Thing is I don't like Arteta but I love Arsenal more. So if that means that we do well and he succeeds, I will very easily deal with not liking him.

Sometimes I do wonder if some people don't hate Arteta (or Wenger in the past) more than they love Arsenal. I'm not saying they do, and I think it's more about losing a bit of perspective because of an understandable emotional reaction to the way one person is going on carrying out their duties that we may not like or agree with.

QuincyAbeyie

That' a weird thing to wonder. Could just as well wonder if people love Arteta more than they love Arsenal because they want him to stay no matter what he does to the club (and to be clear - this would also be a weird thing to wonder).

Qwiss

This idea that you are not getting behind the team if you don't think the sun shines out of Artetas arse is bullshit.

AAStyle

Onemoreinthetolly: Civil War

goon

I think it has less to do with Arteta and more to do with just how entrenched you are in your views. There’s a few on here who have at times riled against Arteta for example that are much more willing to soften their views when the winds start changing. Others want much more evidence before that happens which is fair enough, but the negative consequence of this is that you end up poo pooing everything especially any positive trends identified that could potentially be used to signify progress. Kills the vibe.

mdgoonah41

Row Jimmy wrote:
AAStyle- wrote:
From Peru to New York City. Cool city but dirty and insanely expensive.

NYC is very clean compared to how it used to be. Expensive it certainly is.

true enough.

unless you are in NYC for schooling, or you have a very high paying finance job, i wouldnt want to live in NYC. its fine to visit, to see a play or go to a museum, but i couldnt live there. just too loud, too many people. and way too expensive. and i say this as someone who lives in one of the 5 or 6 biggest cities in the US.

Shady

Arteta has turned things around to an acceptable degree. We were pathetic at the start of the season, but are now in a top 4 race, which I think is where we should be.

I reserve more praise for our young stars, but Arteta has still been part of our turnaround. If we continue this trajectory over a long period of time then he will get my backing, but if he can't sustain it then the knives will rightly come back out.

A manager with proven track record will retain goodwill during tougher setbacks, but a manager whose record is predominantly mediocre will lose backing much quicker.

Sicario

One thing you have to give Arteta massive credit for is that every time he’s looked down the barrel ie when we’ve been in a deep crisis (period before Chelsea at home last season, after the first 3 games this season, after Man Utd Everton away this season, after poor Jan) he’s managed to pull something out of the bag and got us back to winning ways.

Dealing with adversity and coming out stronger on the other side, stopping a rut and turning around a downward spiral are invaluable qualities to have as a manager. Everyone can look good when things are going well. However, dealing with shit and coming out stronger speaks volumes of his man management skills, his strong character/mentality and key motivation skills.

Some of you still refer to him as a ‘rookie manager’ but after 2 years of managing us under the most difficult circumstances in our history (Covid, no fans, strongest Premier League league to date) this can no longer be labelled at him. He’s starting to pay his dues, is clearly learning on the job and we will be all the better for it.

Arteta is improving as a manager and will only get better.

mdgoonah41

my opinion of arteta doesnt change day to day or with the weather. i dont think hes the right person for this job, and i think given the resources hes been afforded (net spend of like £200m the last 2 seasons), we should be more than just on the fringe of the top 4 battle, especially since we've basically only had to play 1 game per week all season. we've still played pretty unattractive football on the whole this season, the big performances have been few and far between. the way hes devalued important club assets, his stubbornness, and again, just the lack of cohesive football (as a whole) just doesnt inspire me or give me any confidence. i think arteta is a smug piece of shit, and when i still put myself through the anguish of watching our games, seeing his face on the sideline makes me unhappy. we can scrape 4th this season and it wouldnt change my opinion of him. because i know we're just one sideways glance from him alienating ramsdale or partey or saka or ESR and then we're going to be right back to square one, talking about his non-negotiables and how he just needs to replace 6 more players in the first XI until he has his team and we'll be able to see things take off.

the problems here are deeper than just arteta. there are major structural issues. but i dont think arteta is part of the solution, and thats unlikely to change unless he changes pretty much his entire personality. im an arsenal supporter and want the team to succeed. i dont root against the team, obviously. i feel better when we win. but i dont feel better about the big picture as long as arteta is here.

AAStyle

mdgoonah41 wrote:
my opinion of arteta doesnt change day to day or with the weather. i dont think hes the right person for this job, and i think given the resources hes been afforded (net spend of like £200m the last 2 seasons), we should be more than just on the fringe of the top 4 battle, especially since we've basically only had to play 1 game per week all season. we've still played pretty unattractive football on the whole this season, the big performances have been few and far between. the way hes devalued important club assets, his stubbornness, and again, just the lack of cohesive football (as a whole) just doesnt inspire me or give me any confidence. i think arteta is a smug piece of shit, and when i still put myself through the anguish of watching our games, seeing his face on the sideline makes me unhappy. we can scrape 4th this season and it wouldnt change my opinion of him. because i know we're just one sideways glance from him alienating ramsdale or partey or saka or ESR and then we're going to be right back to square one, talking about his non-negotiables and how he just needs to replace 6 more players in the first XI until he has his team and we'll be able to see things take off.

the problems here are deeper than just arteta. there are major structural issues. but i dont think arteta is part of the solution, and thats unlikely to change unless he changes pretty much his entire personality. im an arsenal supporter and want the team to succeed. i dont root against the team, obviously. i feel better when we win. but i dont feel better about the big picture as long as arteta is here.

I couldn't agree more.

Burnwinter

Goon's right, it's about the vibe.

I've been amazed how many times we have to taste the same ultra-negative spirit on certain situations where the information isn't even clear, largely because they connect tenuously to the idea the club's in an epochal decline.

When it comes mixed with egregious Wenger nostalgia, the cocktail of misery is quite a thing.

There has been some farcical wallowing going on. Worst case we've got the kernel of a good squad and Arteta's project doesn't pan out.

Mirth

We're overthinking this - if we get 4th then Arteta's done enough to have another 12 months to implement his plans. 5th place and it's debatable but probably another half a season at least. Anything else and he's been fairly irrelevant despite any promising improvements.

QuincyAbeyie

Burnwinter wrote:
Goon's right, it's about the vibe.

I've been amazed how many times we have to taste the same ultra-negative spirit on certain situations where the information isn't even clear, largely because they connect tenuously to the idea the club's in an epochal decline.

When it comes mixed with egregious Wenger nostalgia, the cocktail of misery is quite a thing.

There has been some farcical wallowing going on. Worst case we've got the kernel of a good squad and Arteta's project doesn't pan out.

When is it acceptable to be negative and when isn't it? You had some very depressing/bleak comments yourself about the rest of the season near the end of the transfer window. Is the issue that these last two wins haven't changed other's opinions the way they've changed yours?

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