Buendia does look proper good - but if we're not getting him, we just need to get Odegaard. He's a real top top 10.
Do that and I'm not crying
Emi Buendia
spaceman spiff wrote:Buendia does look proper good - but if we're not getting him, we just need to get Odegaard. He's a real top top 10.
Do that and I'm not crying
they're quite different players, if we sign Odegaard we need to also sign Bissouma.
Also it seems Buendia's going to Norwich cos we did not want to match Villa's offer. This could mean many things...
spaceman spiff wrote:Buendia does look proper good - but if we're not getting him, we just need to get Odegaard. He's a real top top 10.
Do that and I'm not crying
Would you say this top top 10 is top 10?
Aouar is just a player in name.
I can't claim to be a ligue 1 expert but those that have seen him say he's barely been consistent in ligue 1 this season.
As for odegaard. The real number 10 who barely scores or assists. Give me a break.
And if the excuse about him settling in is trotted about.
Buendia was also settling in during his first pl season. Still got better numbers in a relegated outfit.
Some things never change.
10 years ago got rid off cesc and nasri in august and went on a deadline day scramble.
Meh. Not interested in any of those guys, not Buendia, not Aouar or even Ødegaard. Happy to go into next season with just ESR backed up by Willock in the attacking midfield areas, with Saka also being able to cover there. The one to get is Bissouma who would 100% elevate the midfield and represent an incredible upgrade over Xhaka. He’s an N’Golo Kanté, but we’ll probably end up with Sander Berge or some other loser knowing the fools in charge of our transfers.
I want Odegaard back. You can’t look at the assists one his last couple of games and not recogothe the quality. He’s handing out passes like that all game long. Bring him in if Ancelotti is amenable
Claudius wrote:I want Odegaard back. You can’t look at the assists one his last couple of games and not recogothe the quality. He’s handing out passes like that all game long. Bring him in if Ancelotti is amenable
He's handing out passes like that all game?
Must be some different games you're watching because the ones I do seem to suggest we're hardly creating chances.
Unfortunately I don't see us bidding for Buendia if we still believed Ødegaard could be kept. That he's going to Aston Villa for 33m because we're not willing to bid higher than 30 is ridiculous.
Buendia to Villa. Grealish to City. Sterling to us. It’s well obvz
Sterling is on 300k/pw
Quincy Abeyie wrote:Unfortunately I don't see us bidding for Buendia if we still believed Ødegaard could be kept. That he's going to Aston Villa for 33m because we're not willing to bid higher than 30 is ridiculous.
Aye, we shot ourselves in the foot by never sorting out the wage bill. It's all very predictable. I did mention a shift to youth and trimming the fat of the sqaud ages ago and not handing out insane wages to Ramsey Auba ect. Artetas been the first guy to aggressively try to sort it. He should have sold Auba but that would have been short term pain for long term gain. Arteta wasn't comfortable enough in the job to do that.
Apparently villa have also agreed to a sell on clause top teams rarely agree to big sell on clauses. We'll see I think we may increase our bid still.
Ødegaard is quality. Absolute quality. His touch, his passing and his vision are levels above what we have now even though he lacks in movement and urgency. The likes of him and Buendia have multiplier effects. They make those around them better, numbers notwithstanding. We need a player like that. Really disappointing that we are missing out on Buendia while it seems that Ødegaard is out of bounds.
State of this club.
Quincy Abeyie wrote:Unfortunately I don't see us bidding for Buendia if we still believed Ødegaard could be kept. That he's going to Aston Villa for 33m because we're not willing to bid higher than 30 is ridiculous.
By all accounts we made a 2nd bid.
Just weird that he chose to go to Villa immediately like we are nothing instead of waiting for a 3rd bid. I believe it's probably the project presented to him and the wage package rather than the transfer bid.
We must have told his agent that they wouldn't get a better wage package from us than what Villa was offering. Nothing else explains the immediate decision.
Clrnc wrote:Quincy Abeyie wrote:Unfortunately I don't see us bidding for Buendia if we still believed Ødegaard could be kept. That he's going to Aston Villa for 33m because we're not willing to bid higher than 30 is ridiculous.
By all accounts we made a 2nd bid.
That's not true, quite a few contradictory reports that say we never put in an official bid, with reliable people on either side.
Reading between the lines, my guess is we basically "bid" or put in an enquiry without officially bidding, Buendia probably sussed that we're not 100% committed to signing him and just went for Villa instead. Basically like the Higuain/Suarez situation. It's probably why Villa got it done so quickly.
Like I said earlier, it's fine if we get Odegaard or someone else higher up the list, but if we don't...
I hope we have a price for a number 10 we aren't breaking and that's why we didn't get him. It's not an area we need huge investment in as we have ESR so it makes sense not to splash out. Probably the same reason we wanted him vs Odegaard too.
Qwiss! wrote:I hope we have a price for a number 10 we aren't breaking and that's why we didn't get him. It's not an area we need huge investment in as we have ESR so it makes sense not to splash out. Probably the same reason we wanted him vs Odegaard too.
Hopefully. That said, we did that last season and spent the first half of the season without a playmaker. I think that lack of a playmaker before December is the biggest reason we finished 8th
BWooley wrote:Hopefully we missed out on Buendia because Luis Campos is joining and has an alternate option in mind who is better (of course not, but one can dream till we land Fekir).
Agreed to go to RM apparently.
Claudius wrote:Qwiss! wrote:I hope we have a price for a number 10 we aren't breaking and that's why we didn't get him. It's not an area we need huge investment in as we have ESR so it makes sense not to splash out. Probably the same reason we wanted him vs Odegaard too.
Hopefully. That said, we did that last season and spent the first half of the season without a playmaker. I think that lack of a playmaker before December is the biggest reason we finished 8th
Even with Saka at number 10 we looked fine after ESR and Odegaard came into the team. I don't see why that wouldn't work again. The early half of the season was a disgrace for many reasons, we had capable players to fit at number 10 though we were just using the wrong ones.
Quincy Abeyie wrote:BWooley wrote:Hopefully we missed out on Buendia because Luis Campos is joining and has an alternate option in mind who is better (of course not, but one can dream till we land Fekir).
Agreed to go to RM apparently.
Well, this is a grand weekend. He will probably stop Real from dealing Odegaard as well. Would tell them to sell all their Brazilians not named Vinicius.
Can we please lock this provocative thread?
Odegaard's wonderful numbers are worse than Buendia's for a relegated outfit.
1 goal 2 assists in 15 games.
How can you justify that sort of productivity in an amc position because it's not like they're compensated elsewhere.
Obviously Buendia is a Dynamo.
But with creators, you shouldn’t look at the assists. You should be be looking at the chances created and balls into the box. Football is too low scoring a game to judge your judgements of creative players on the final outputs. Those final assist numbers are too prone to variance. I would happily take Odegaard back if he’s surplus to requirements at Madrid.
flobaba wrote:Can we please lock this provocative thread?
This window is starting awfully shit, even by our own grand standards
Claudius wrote:Obviously Buendia is a Dynamo.
But with creators, you shouldn’t look at the assists. You should be be looking at the chances created and balls into the box. Football is too low scoring a game to judge your judgements of creative players on the final outputs. Those final assist numbers are too prone to variance. I would happily take Odegaard back if he’s surplus to requirements at Madrid.
He's very naturally talented (think first touch and awareness), but... I dunno, he's kinda meh. A bit too specialist AM?
Would much rather a Buendia.
Ode is more early Ozil (when he gave a toss), nice player with an amazing left foot who can find space anywhere on the pitch, connect the other forwards to the midfield and keep us with the ball higher up the pitch. Unlike Ozil though, Ode is willing to pressure from the front and help his mates out a bit.
Buendia is a bit like Sanchez. Maybe a bit more technically secure and a bit less physically exceptional - but an aggressive ball carrier that will always try to make something happen, sometimes at the expense of keeping the ball higher up the pitch - meaning his game is more transitional.
A team that's genuinely going for top honours would go for both, but obviously we're not at that stage yet. People not rating Ode because of stats just aren't looking closely enough. He is exceptional and it would be a huge deal if we could get him.
goon wrote:Clrnc wrote:By all accounts we made a 2nd bid.
That's not true, quite a few contradictory reports that say we never put in an official bid, with reliable people on either side.
Reading between the lines, my guess is we basically "bid" or put in an enquiry without officially bidding, Buendia probably sussed that we're not 100% committed to signing him and just went for Villa instead. Basically like the Higuain/Suarez situation. It's probably why Villa got it done so quickly.
Like I said earlier, it's fine if we get Odegaard or someone else higher up the list, but if we don't...
I only trust Bell, Wheatley and maybe Watt/Romano. The reports that say we never put in an official bid actually came from Argentina who is dodgy as fuck. We can't put in an enquiry without a price, it's definitely a bid and it got rejected. Higuain situation is different because our bid actually got accepted and Madrid changed their mind last min when Napoli came in.
Yeah we better have someone better up our sleeves. It's terrible PR to lose out to Villa but who cares if we can have a better window at the end.
Yeah it seems pretty obvious that we made one bid. Don't think we made a second one though, or it'd probably have been accepted by Norwich.
Probably Edu didn't receive as much kickbacks as he hoped for. Easier to explain things
Someone mentioned Martinez factor previously. Might be true, they have the same agent.
Ode is more like Ozil?
Prime ozil was the fastest to 50 assists in the PL.
Not sure odegaard is going to get 50 assists in his career.
If you're playing in the front 3-4 then you need to back that up with goals and/or assists. No 2 ways about it.
We have 2 CM's who hardly score. It's up to the 3 behind the striker and the forward to get the numbers.
Ode can press and look good in youtube videos with a couple of decent moments but the last 6 months I've seen him make 3 direct contributions to goals and the least creative arsenal side in the last 20 years.
I really wish we sign Ødegaard. May be Edu's way will work with Real Madrid.
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]It is also worth pointing out that we have adjusted Emi Buendia’s numbers when he was in the Premier League last season, to have a more fair comparison.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]Buendia played for a team who were at the bottom of the league for the majority of last campaign.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]His argument of being a better goalscorer can be proved by his Expected goals (xG). The Argentine accumulated an xG of 2.2 last season. While ESR has an xG of 2.0 and Odegaard’s is 1.1.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]The Norwich man is clearly way better than the duo when it came to expected assists (xA). The 24-year-old’s xA stood at 7.2, while ESR and the Real Madrid loanee’s figures stood at 2.8 and 2.1 respectively.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]When it came to the percentage of Shots on Target, ESR sat in first position. The Hale End graduate saw 30.8% of his shots hitting the mark. While Buendia’s figure stood at 27.5 and Odegaard’s number was 18.8. The Norwegian is a player who does not take many shots and thus naturally does not score many. Acquiring him from the Spanish capital might not solve the problem of midfielders not scoring goals for this Arsenal squad.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]The Norwegian has occasionally been criticized for slowing down team moves. And the data proves it. He attempts most Short Passes among the three. Buendia’s 6.53 Long Passes per 90 minutes might make Arsenal more unpredictable and direct.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]Moving on, Buendia, ESR and Odegaard’s number in Shot Creating Actions is 5.04, 2.30 and 3.63. Thus the fans can expect more direct involvement from the Argentine on their end product than the other two.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]Judging how Mikel Arteta demands increased defensive responsibility from his midfielders, signing the Norwich star makes even more sense. Buendia is clearly ahead of the two in terms of Tackles Made per 90 at 3.21. While ESR and Odegaard’s numericals are 0.86 and 0.53.[/font][/size]
[size=small][font=Montserrat, sans-serif]The Championship player of the year also puts the opponents under pressure more than the duo. That can lead to Arsenal gaining possession in opponent’s half more often.[/font][/size]
Of course, this is a forum where an attacking midfielder is coveted for not assisting, and Giroud was considered only worse than the top 5 strikers in football despite never being prolific.
There’s no doubt that Buendia had off the charts numbers last year and would’ve made a lot of sense as a squad addition. It’s done. Hopefully it’s not litigated for the next year. Best way to avoid that is Edu’s way yielding some good signings
He would be a good addition but agree Claude - there’s so many ways we can strengthen
This whole thing sucks.
Still loads of window left but this doesn't fill you with confidence.
The frustrating thing is knowing how much Villa paid. It was just good value. We could've just paid 5 mil more. The guy is great value.