Edu Named Technical Director: Page 9 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Edu Named Technical Director

Clrnc

Ricky you don't think we bought and sold well? Might be wrong but thought you rated our window much better than the rest of the top 6.

I feel like we did back Emery and Arteta reasonably well in the windows. Of course Willian is a huge failure but most signings are an improvement on the incumbent. Arteta failure to integrate Saliba and Pepe properly is up to him

Burnwinter

"Realistic dissidence is the trademark of anyone who has a new idea in business."

Dein's generative and restless qualities as a businessman got us where he got us, and got him turfed. Gazidis doesn't possess those qualities.

Ricky1985

Claudius wrote:
You say that but I think there is a lot more to buying and selling well.

Reason I say this is I’ve run negotiations for buying what appear to be quite simple products and services. And once you actually go backwards into the operations, you quickly discover opportunities to save millions from the original spec. Or you realise the spec was wrong. You don’t just buy and sell. It’s deeply integrated into how you run your business. Everything has to be in sync.

And even then, getting the right spec isn’t enough. You then need to accurately understand relative values, especially in non-competitive markets like player sales where every player is unique. Getting any of these things wrong creates tons of value leakage. And it’s often hard to see on the surface.

There are many variables that go into making an organisation as efficient as possible, and with every gain in efficiency you increase your chances of success that little bit more - I agree enitrely. But football is a little bit different, and the clubs we're talking about make their gains relative to others when they find a diamond playing for a tiny team in France or sign a young talent and turn him into a £150m goldmine after getting superstar performances from him for a sustained period. And ultimately the best clubs put together a team that has players in it that they seemingly had no business being able to sign and certainly not for the amount they got them for.

You can have all the scouts you want, as we did, and if the club is tilted toward a DoF (which ours was not), you'll sign well and put a team full of talent out on the pitch, but if you lack a great coach, you won't have signed the right talented players, the one's that come together to form a great team, and success will be lacking - see Dortmund, for example, or Chelsea this season. A scout can tell a DoF when a player is a must sign, and a smart DoF will know when to listen and when not to, and he'll also be shrewd enough to get shit done when it really matters, but he doesn't know how to build a team - that's what a great coach does, that's his genius. So, if you get a club that is missing the DoF, but has the coach, the club won't get the talent, the coach will know exactly how to put together a great team, he'll know all the players he wants and how he wants to play, but it will never materialise. He'll get a tune out of what he has, by and large or for a period of time, but no matter how well you coach and how balanced your team is, quality is the decisive factor - see Wenger at Arsenal from 2007 to, perhaps, 2015-ish.

I am quite confident we have a coach in Arteta that has good judgement, knows the team he wants and how he wants to build it - and I accept I could be very wrong about that - but I really am not sure about the other part in Edu. I think it would be crazy to think he hasn't driven the Luiz and Willian purchases given who his agent is, so I'm not fond of what I have seen him do, and I'm not convinced when I listen to him speak either. I really hope I'm wrong because he needs to do a lot of very good business this January.

Ricky1985

Clrnc wrote:
Ricky you don't think we bought and sold well? Might be wrong but thought you rated our window much better than the rest of the top 6.

I feel like we did back Emery and Arteta reasonably well in the windows. Of course Willian is a huge failure but most signings are an improvement on the incumbent. Arteta failure to integrate Saliba and Pepe properly is up to him

I think I gave us 7 or 7.5 out of 10, if memory serves, but that was factoring in Covid and the problems that brought. You also have to remember that we are talking about 5 years (and then some!) of pathetic squad building, so it is a long way back for us relative to our rivals. Gabriel and Partey are magnificent signings though, let's be clear about that, and are another thing that gives me hope about Arteta and his vision for the team he wants. And I suppose I should give credit to Edu for getting them done too.

We hear now of Konate, Aouar, Szboszlai... again players I like the sound of, and another plus for Arteta's judgement in my view, now we need Edu to do his part and get another 2 or 3 Gabriels and Parteys in the next two windows, and if the market picks up as it should, a huge number of them out the door.

goon

Gazza M wrote:
goon wrote:
Because he’s an Arsenal player? 😆

The cynicism of Arsenal fans is unreal at this point.

I’m seeing fans tear into Edu for making some perfectly valid points, but that’s always going to happen when you give an interview at a time like this.

Because its a massively questionable signing, and his reasoning that he needs time to adapt is desperate sounding nonsense

Whatever you or I think it’s clearly a player Arteta wanted. He doesn’t play every min if that wasn’t the case. And this is a guy who was Chelsea’s best player post lockdown, you’d think he’s a worker plucked off Kia’s farm.

Of course he’s going to try an rationalise and back up a signing they made just a couple of months ago, Arsenal fans actually want him to say ‘he’s shit, my agent made me sign him, sorry’.

I like hearing from Edu/the club, but the problem with doing these sorts of interviews is that there is no right answer for anything. Fans will use it to confirm their worst assumptions. In reality, Willian was a player performing really well at a top 4 PL club on a free, Arteta liked the look of him, bam. Bad decision? Clearly, but nothing more complicated than that.

Ray

I think those responses from Edu seem really defensive and almost blind support for the players and manager. I know the purpose was to encourage Arteta and the players but it’s a bit comical to be so sure of how everything is going well and to plan when it clearly isn’t. If he came out and said they are looking at the performances and it isn’t good enough for a club like Arsenal but he believes they can turn it around then it would be received much better.

I also think there may be a language barrier. Strange to be using the word “boom” in a professional capacity.

Both Edu and Arteta are showing their inexperience by being blindly loyal to individuals rather than performances, when they don't have to be.

Qwiss

Edu has no idea how to do this job. They need to go back to square one like when Emery was brought in. They had the right idea with the division of responsibilities then, they just need to get the right people in this time.

Qwiss

Rohit wrote:
I thought we signed Willian so that we added a senior player that didn't need to adapt.

No you need to give him a season or two to adapt to Arsenal before he retires.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Agreed, Qwiss.

Darn the Egg Idiot.

awooga83

Edu comments really make me uncomfortable with him. I think he's too close to Kia and that's shown by his talking up of Willian and just out of touch comments. It looks like another mistake having this guy who just doesn't seem to have a clue either. Too much inexperienced everywhere.

goon

Our of interest, what could have Edu said that would have made folk think 'this guy is the business'? What do you guys want him to say about Willian?

Mirth

Qwiss! wrote:
Edu has no idea how to do this job. They need to go back to square one like when Emery was brought in. They had the right idea with the division of responsibilities then, they just need to get the right people in this time.

Agree, I liked the sound of Gazidis on paper. It's just that losing him and Wenger in the space of a few months left a significant power vacuum at the top.

deardevil

Qwiss! wrote:
Edu has no idea how to do this job. They need to go back to square one like when Emery was brought in. They had the right idea with the division of responsibilities then, they just need to get the right people in this time.

Yep! The only reason we got Edu was because he played for us

We previously identified Monchi and Sven and they were good options. Edu stunk from the beginning.

AAStyle

goon wrote:
Our of interest, what could have Edu said that would have made folk think 'this guy is the business'? What do you guys want him to say about Willian?

Being smart involves knowing when to stay silent. Now, if he couldn't avoid the interview he could easily have said that they are working tirelessly towards new additions, and learning from our good and not so good past experiences.

awooga83

goon wrote:
Our of interest, what could have Edu said that would have made folk think 'this guy is the business'? What do you guys want him to say about Willian?

Well not to say that you think Willian is not expected to come in and perform, when you sign a 32 year old player that's exactly what I expect surely that's the whole point of recruiting that kind of player because he was never outstanding for Chelsea, decent squad player but inconsistent. So if you invest those resources in him I think he has to be making a difference pretty much asap.

Now I may not buy it but he can say I think Willian will come good he's struggled whatever, but saying he wasn't expected to be ready to perform to me is absurd and undermines your credibility when you are in charge of recruitment. Especially if you also said on his signing "I'm really excited to have a player like Willian and I'm convinced he'll be one to impact the team straight away"

Claudius

Ricky1985 wrote:
Clrnc wrote:
Ricky you don't think we bought and sold well? Might be wrong but thought you rated our window much better than the rest of the top 6.

I feel like we did back Emery and Arteta reasonably well in the windows. Of course Willian is a huge failure but most signings are an improvement on the incumbent. Arteta failure to integrate Saliba and Pepe properly is up to him

I think I gave us 7 or 7.5 out of 10, if memory serves, but that was factoring in Covid and the problems that brought. You also have to remember that we are talking about 5 years (and then some!) of pathetic squad building, so it is a long way back for us relative to our rivals. Gabriel and Partey are magnificent signings though, let's be clear about that, and are another thing that gives me hope about Arteta and his vision for the team he wants. And I suppose I should give credit to Edu for getting them done too.

We hear now of Konate, Aouar, Szboszlai... again players I like the sound of, and another plus for Arteta's judgement in my view, now we need Edu to do his part and get another 2 or 3 Gabriels and Parteys in the next two windows, and if the market picks up as it should, a huge number of them out the door.

And if the market doesn't pick up?

goon

AAStyle- wrote:
goon wrote:
Our of interest, what could have Edu said that would have made folk think 'this guy is the business'? What do you guys want him to say about Willian?

Being smart involves knowing when to stay silent. Now, if he couldn't avoid the interview he could easily have said that they are working tirelessly towards new additions, and learning from our good and not so good past experiences.

I agree, but then we used to hammer Gazidis for hiding during our bad periods and letting Wenger take all the slack. He was asked specifically about Willian, it wasn't just a statement he released that he could be all vague about, and no one would have appreciated politician like answers either.

If Arteta goes then the idea of Edu leading the transition scares me, not because I think he's rubbish at his job, but because I have no idea. But by the same token, I have no idea how anyone can come to any sort of assessment on him at this stage.

goon

awooga83 wrote:
goon wrote:
Our of interest, what could have Edu said that would have made folk think 'this guy is the business'? What do you guys want him to say about Willian?

Well not to say that you think Willian is not expected to come in and perform, when you sign a 32 year old player that's exactly what I expect surely that's the whole point of recruiting that kind of player because he was never outstanding for Chelsea, decent squad player but inconsistent. So if you invest those resources in him I think he has to be making a difference pretty much asap.

Now I may not buy it but he can say I think Willian will come good he's struggled whatever, but saying he wasn't expected to be ready to perform to me is absurd and undermines your credibility when you are in charge of recruitment. Especially if you also said on his signing "I'm really excited to have a player like Willian and I'm convinced he'll be one to impact the team straight away"

He's just being defensive, both of their decision to sign him and of Willian generally. The transfer has been a failure, but he can't come out and say that or even hint that.

Qwiss

goon wrote:
Our of interest, what could have Edu said that would have made folk think 'this guy is the business'? What do you guys want him to say about Willian?

I don't know, he could have not signed his mates player for a start. That whole "if you don't think Willians great you don't know anything about football" is Peter Hill Wood tier arrogance though.

Burnwinter

AAStyle- wrote:
Being smart involves knowing when to stay silent. Now, if he couldn't avoid the interview he could easily have said that they are working tirelessly towards new additions, and learning from our good and not so good past experiences.

I'd agree he is unwise to name specific players or express frustration with ordinary questions, but he's technical director not CEO, not a Gazidis.

It's a reasonable expectation that a technical director speak publicly on football matters, for example discussing general aspects of the squad such as its average age, its depth, its strengths and weaknesses in different areas of the pitch, or the club's general standpoint on wages and contracts, the club's approach to sensitive matters that come to light like the conflict between Luiz and Ceballos, etc.

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