La Liga 2019/20: Page 9 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

La Liga 2019/20

jones

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/50203474

Granada have been very impressive this season, 20 points after 10 games, sitting in 1st defeating even the likes of Barcelona and pushing Madrid for 90 minutes for a draw

And according to the Beeb it's all because Tony Adams put them on the path. Same Adams who's record there was seven games seven defeats 😆

Meatwad

jones wrote:
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/50203474

Granada have been very impressive this season, 20 points after 10 games, sitting in 1st defeating even the likes of Barcelona and pushing Madrid for 90 minutes for a draw

And according to the Beeb it's all because Tony Adams put them on the path. Same Adams who's record there was seven games seven defeats 😆

that's hilarious. to be white and british is to be given handjobs by the media and referees constantly.

Bold Tone

Meatwad wrote:
jones wrote:
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/50203474

Granada have been very impressive this season, 20 points after 10 games, sitting in 1st defeating even the likes of Barcelona and pushing Madrid for 90 minutes for a draw

And according to the Beeb it's all because Tony Adams put them on the path. Same Adams who's record there was seven games seven defeats 😆

that's hilarious. to be white and british is to be given handjobs by the media and referees constantly.

Forgive me but did either of you actually read the article?

The former Arsenal captain was often seen as a figure of fun during his brief spell with Granada, but that perception deserves to be turned on its head considering the way Adams instigated a key culture shift before his departure.

Adams insisted that Jiang should restructure the club with a focus on Spaniards - in the boardroom, in the sports directive, in the dugout, and on the pitch.

Granada's new local identity - instigated by their Chinese owner on the advice his English adviser - quickly provided the stability that had been missing and Granada's first season back in the second tier yielded a relatively satisfactory 10th-place finish.

But then came the masterstroke: the appointment of a young and dynamic new manager, Diego Martinez.

jones

I did read it. It's beyond ridiculous to claim that any of this development was down to his one piece of advice which was as generic as it gets. Even worse to mention that and then not speak of his abysmal record there or his ridiculous antics on the training ground which make it even more unlikely anyone's paid a lot of attention to what he advised.

Meatwad

i did read it. in no reality is tony adams a central figure for granada's turnaround for some generic ass "you need more spaniards."

flobaba

Emery needs to tell Raul and Vinai to get more Englishmen.

Bold Tone

jones wrote:
I did read it. It's beyond ridiculous to claim that any of this development was down to his one piece of advice which was as generic as it gets. Even worse to mention that and then not speak of his abysmal record there or his ridiculous antics on the training ground which make it even more unlikely anyone's paid a lot of attention to what he advised.

The article addresses that abysmal record by reminding us that he was seen as a figure of fun.
It then quotes an English freelance journalist and Granada fan who has been living in the city since 2006 who repeats what has been verified by reputable news organisations.

jones wrote:
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/50203474

... according to the Beeb it's all because Tony Adams put them on the path. Same Adams who's record there was seven games seven defeats 😆

Let's look at that in detail.
Granada's record that season was

8 losses and 5 draws before the first win 14 games into the season (December).

4 more losses and 2 more draws before their 2nd win in February!

2 wins, 1 draw and 7 losses from Feb to April leading to the manager getting sacked.

7 losses under Adams to finish the season.

The manager he replaced, Lucas Alcaraz, was appointed October when they were winless with 5 losses and 2 draws.
After guaranteeing their relegation with a pathetic spell (4 wins, 6 draws and 14 losses) the boss rolled the dice with a guy with this "mad" idea

“I believe that with patience, the structure we are setting in place will be able to take the club where we want it to be once more,” Adams said last week. “We want to be a mid-table team in La Liga with players who belong to Granada CF, with a world‑class academy developing local and Spanish players, with world‑class training facilities.
...
All these things will take time, as sometimes you need to take one step back and clear up all the problems, before you can take two steps forward.”

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/apr/10/tony-adams-granada-manager-end-of-season

These are the facts as far as I can make out and it's not ridiculous that a local fan thinks it set them up for this revival and I'm guessing Tony Adams' ideas (generic or not) have now been implemented and Granada's new local identity has provided the stability that has stopped the rot.

Edit:

As for this,

Meatwad wrote:
...
that's hilarious. to be white and british is to be given handjobs by the media and referees constantly.

Klaus

Lucas Perez scored against Atletico Madrid:

Bloke's in a mean goalscoring form at the moment.

jones

@Tone I applaud the effort in that post and the research but I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve here. I watched a good bit La Liga until around that season that Granada were relegated and with them having Tony Adams in charge I obviously paid a lot of attention to them and the end of their season.

Granada had little to no hope of surviving before Adams and nobody actually expected him to keep them up, they were hoping he could start building something there so they could bounce right back. The thing is Granada looked genuinely lost in their last seven games, at the time there were plenty of publications both English and Spanish with loads of tidbits and background stories how Adams was badly out of his depth. There's a reason his coaching stints before have been Portsmouth which burned him in England where demented fossils with not even half of Tony's playing career get a job and the other job was in Azerbaijan.

Bold Tone

I hear you.
It didn't take much research, TBH
https://footystats.org/clubs/spain/granada-cf
I'm probably being overly sensitive in regards to Adams. :hat:

QuincyAbeyie

Just another Tuesday for Messi.

Lobbed through ball assist:
Free kick goal:
Whatever the fuck this is goal:
Threaded assist through the defense and midfield to top it off:

Bold Tone

As you said, just another Tuesday.
Not one person is surprised and the commentator just laughs every time.
He is the only ~~man~~ outfield player who can be the MOTM without running or moving out of that Messi box in midfield.

Mirth

That angle doesn't do Messi's second goal justice.

arsedocmd

That turn...ugh, it's so fucking natural..like he's communicating with and telling the ball where he'll be and asking it to be there with him

arsedocmd

His goal against nigeria in the world cup was a bit similar too.

Bold Tone

jones wrote:
@Tone I applaud the effort in that post and the research but I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve here. I watched a good bit La Liga until around that season that Granada were relegated and with them having Tony Adams in charge I obviously paid a lot of attention to them and the end of their season.

Granada had little to no hope of surviving before Adams and nobody actually expected him to keep them up, they were hoping he could start building something there so they could bounce right back. The thing is Granada looked genuinely lost in their last seven games, at the time there were plenty of publications both English and Spanish with loads of tidbits and background stories how Adams was badly out of his depth. There's a reason his coaching stints before have been Portsmouth which burned him in England where demented fossils with not even half of Tony's playing career get a job and the other job was in Azerbaijan.

The article only throws up an argument that "maybe" Adams' advice started it off which is nothing outrageous.

In fact, it could even be argued Adams planted the seeds for the team's current success.

I also doubt that you or any of us has followed them as closely as the source in the article.

Heath Chesters, an English freelance journalist and Granada fan who has been living in the city since 2006.

Many of us know the history but this article provides a bit more detail for those that don't

In essence, that was all Adams was there for. Plans were afoot to push the restart button at the club, and Adams’ escape route was already established. His intention from the beginning was to step down and get to work finding a replacement once the season was over. José Luis Oltra, a vastly experienced coach in the Spanish lower divisions, was eventually chosen to take over.

For now, Adams continues to work for Lizhang. Predicting where he’ll be next is no small feat. Perhaps he’ll be parachuted in at whichever club is in desperate need of a restructuring. What seems certain is that his coaching career is over, as is the dream that he would make a triumphant return to where it all began at Arsenal. His relationship with the club seems irreparably damaged by a number of highly critical interviews he gave. While he remains revered as an ex-player, there doesn’t appear to be much interest from clubs in the UK.

https://thesefootballtimes.co/2018/03/27/the-bizarre-coaching-odyssey-of-tony-adams/

jones

Of course you would doubt that Tone you also take Ben Arfas word ahead of mine. If it's not enough for you that I actually watched the games in question why do you keep this discussion going

jones

Mirth wrote:
That angle doesn't do Messi's second goal justice.

Outrageous doesn't begin to describe it. In 20 years I've never compared any goal to Bergkamp vs Newcastle but this one has to be the first direct descendant of it. And this is him somehow still finding his feet after his injury, incredible.

Clrnc

Not sure why but when it's Messi doing it he just makes it look ordinary and easy. I'm totally not surprised.

Bold Tone

jones wrote:
Of course you would doubt that Tone you also take Ben Arfas word ahead of mine. If it's not enough for you that I actually watched the games in question why do you keep this discussion going

You are one who tried to undermine the article with your opinion.
I simply pointed out that Heath Chesters view about his team were credible and trump those of anyone (you) with just a passing interest in his club.

Heath Chesters, an English freelance journalist and Granada fan who has been living in the city since 2006.
...

jones wrote:
... I watched a good bit La Liga until around that season that Granada were relegated and with them having Tony Adams in charge I obviously paid a lot of attention to them and the end of their season.
...

It's totally reasonable to assume that a local supporter would know a bit more about his club's progression as, unlike you, he would have paid a lot of attention to them before Tony Adams got there and continue to pay a lot of attention to them after he left.

As for Ben Arfa, I agree with him even more now after a year of watching Emery shout ineffectually from the sidelines as not only was he getting it from Emery but, before the coaches' box was introduced, his boy Carcedo used to give it as well.

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