Trumpism: Page 63 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Trumpism

flobaba

y va marquer wrote:
flobaba wrote:
Genuine question: What does it mean to be white?

It's a question I have never asked myself.
It doesn't mean anything at all to me in terms of how I see, define or describe myself.
I don't associate any of my character, traits, habits with my being white.
Being white doesn't inspire any feelings of pride or superiority - if anything I would wish that people who aren't white would not hold my being white against me, not judge me for it or assume things about me because of it.

I asked because I only became aware that I was "black" when I arrived in the States. Skin color meant absolutely nothing to me, and I was quite oblivious of any racial politics or connotations beforehand. In many ways I still am, but increasingly I find myself uncomfortable, even wary, in certain situations - with both African Americans and other races - because I can sense they expect a certain type of behavior or attitude (stereotype).

I don't really care as I can't live my life based on other people's expectations but it can sometimes be a bit tricky navigating these spaces.

Mirth

I think the way that manifests itself is different in different countries. No doubt there's an element of that everywhere but there's less expectation to behave in accordance to your 'race' because there's less of an identity attached to it. In my experience, the geographical divide within the UK or the underlying classism carries far more baggage in terms of shaping how people live their lives and the impact it has on their opportunities. I'm not commenting on whether it's better or worse since I only have experience of one side but it is a difference I've noticed.

Qwiss

I live in a mid sized town in rural(ish) Ireland. I could go days without seeing anyone who wasn't white.

y va marquer

I live in the city centre and work for a multi national am with people who are neither Irish nor white daily.

We all get along grand, there's no great divide.

In my experience the greatest social tension and schisms are between Irish people from non working, non university educated backgrounds and those who are third level qualified and predominantly from middle classes.
Though that seems more confined to urban than rural areas.

flobaba

Were you born and raised there qs? What informs your outlook on race relations? Would you say most of the people in your town have the same perspective as you do? (I assume you are a decent person with little or no racial bias whatsoever, based solely off my "knowledge" of you through your posting history. For all I know you could be plotting the 4th Reich with your fellow Irish McSomethings...)

In a somewhat related story I recently resumed work at a new job with predominantly European (German, Austrian) influence, and I don't feel as pressured for whatever reason. However, one of my American colleagues (white) came up to me a couple days ago, and I guess in an effort to make small talk, asked me to "Teach me how to dougie"...

I looked at him, hard, square in the eye, and simply said: "No."

I watched him squirm uncomfortably for a moment or two, before I looked away and continued with my task.

Qwiss

Yep I've been born and raised here. I lived in Dublin for years though where obviously there's far more diversity. I've worked with people from all around the world. I worked in the US for a few months and obviously young get to know a lot more no-white folks. Went to college in Wales but that was very white too. I've been insulted and threatened for being Irish in the UK too, that tends to effect how you feel about people hating on others too. And I started listening to public enemy when I was 11, that has informed my opinions on race relations as much as anything. 😆

As for attitudes here it varies. Most people wouldn't consider themselves racists and you'd see incredibly different attitudes towards black people from the US or UK vs those from Africa. There's actually very little immigration here from the middle east or africa but plenty of people still have problems with immigrants and asylum seekers.

I've never asked a black person to teach me how to Dougie.

y va marquer

I've never been insulted or threatened for being Irish in the UK, I was insulted for being white and "American" in Paris though, seperate incidents, one quite amusing the other unsettling.

y va marquer

Been physically assaulted and insulted for being a woman on many occasions though.

Qwiss

y va marquer wrote:
I've never been insulted or threatened for being Irish in the UK

It happened me and my friends a number of times when we lived in Swansea. Very weird. I've also seen it happen with English to the Irish on holidays in the Canaries. Football hooligan types seem to have a problem with the Irish.

y va marquer

Qwiss! wrote:
y va marquer wrote:
I've never been insulted or threatened for being Irish in the UK

It happened me and my friends a number of times when we lived in Swansea. Very weird. I've also seen it happen with English to the Irish on holidays in the Canaries. Football hooligan types seem to have a problem with the Irish.

Football hooligan types have a problem with everyone who's not in their tribe.

Trump’s obviously been put on message to respond to the state of emergency

“We condemn in the strongest possible terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides,” Trump said, then repeating, “On many sides.”

He called on “swift restoration of law and order and the protection of innocent lives,” and said that, “No child should ever be afraid to go outside and play or be with their parents and have a good time.”

Trump then segued into a familiar check-list of his self-proclaimed accomplishments, including “absolute record employment, unemployment the lowest its been in 17 years, companies pouring into our country.”

“We have so many incredible things happening in our country, so when I watch Charlottesville to me it’s very, very sad.”

“No matter our color, creed, religion or political party,” he said, “we are all Americans first. We love our country, we love our God, we love our flag, we’re proud of our country, we’re proud of who we are, so we want to get the situation straightened out in Charlottesville and want to study it and see what we’re doing wrong in this country.”

“We have to respect each other, ideally we have to love each other.”

Tony Montana

Mirth wrote:
I think the way that manifests itself is different in different countries. No doubt there's an element of that everywhere but there's less expectation to behave in accordance to your 'race' because there's less of an identity attached to it. In my experience, the geographical divide within the UK or the underlying classism carries far more baggage in terms of shaping how people live their lives and the impact it has on their opportunities. I'm not commenting on whether it's better or worse since I only have experience of one side but it is a difference I've noticed.

Have you read the "Good Immigrant"? It's a collection of essays by 1st, 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants to the USA edited by Nikesh Shukla. Great book.

Race is a major factor in how people perceive you no matter your class. This books shares great accounts.

Tony Montana

Qwiss! wrote:
y va marquer wrote:
I've never been insulted or threatened for being Irish in the UK

It happened me and my friends a number of times when we lived in Swansea. Very weird. I've also seen it happen with English to the Irish on holidays in the Canaries. Football hooligan types seem to have a problem with the Irish.

It was even worse in the 60s and 70s.

Yet so many English have Irish blood.

Qwiss

Tony Montana wrote:
Qwiss! wrote:
It happened me and my friends a number of times when we lived in Swansea. Very weird. I've also seen it happen with English to the Irish on holidays in the Canaries. Football hooligan types seem to have a problem with the Irish.

It was even worse in the 60s and 70s.

Yet so many English have Irish blood.

I remember reading John Lyons autobiography years ago and he talked about how he had to deal with so much abuse cos his family were Irish and yet now he seems to have terrible attitudes towards immigrants himself. Morrissey is the same. It's like Biggus, Irish man in Australia who thinks other races shouldn't be allowed to emigrate to Australia.

Mirth

Tony Montana wrote:
Mirth wrote:
I think the way that manifests itself is different in different countries. No doubt there's an element of that everywhere but there's less expectation to behave in accordance to your 'race' because there's less of an identity attached to it. In my experience, the geographical divide within the UK or the underlying classism carries far more baggage in terms of shaping how people live their lives and the impact it has on their opportunities. I'm not commenting on whether it's better or worse since I only have experience of one side but it is a difference I've noticed.

Have you read the "Good Immigrant"? It's a collection of essays by 1st, 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants to the USA edited by Nikesh Shukla. Great book.

Race is a major factor in how people perceive you no matter your class. This books shares great accounts.

No, I will check it out though! Having read the synopsis it seems to focus on the UK which is fine and entirely valid but in response to flo's post the experience is different in the US (and every other country) based on the policies and narratives that have been encouraged by society and politics. Of course race is a major factor in how people perceive you but that perception itself varies from place to place which was my point.

Tony Montana

y va marquer wrote:
flobaba wrote:
Genuine question: What does it mean to be white?

It's a question I have never asked myself.
It doesn't mean anything at all to me in terms of how I see, define or describe myself.
I don't associate any of my character, traits, habits with my being white.
Being white doesn't inspire any feelings of pride or superiority - if anything I would wish that people who aren't white would not hold my being white against me, not judge me for it or assume things about me because of it.

In general though there's a privilege you get because of your whiteness that non-whites don't get in the West. That's not your fault personally. Nor is it wrong that most people in the West are white.

However, the reality is your whiteness means standardness.

Tony Montana

Mirth wrote:
Tony Montana wrote:
Have you read the "Good Immigrant"? It's a collection of essays by 1st, 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants to the USA edited by Nikesh Shukla. Great book.

Race is a major factor in how people perceive you no matter your class. This books shares great accounts.

No, I will check it out though! Having read the synopsis it seems to focus on the UK which is fine and entirely valid but in response to flo's post the experience is different in the US (and every other country) based on the policies and narratives that have been encouraged by society and politics. Of course race is a major factor in how people perceive you but that perception itself varies from place to place which was my point.

Sorry I meant UK. My bad. Apologies mirth.
[size=large]Just to be clear I have actually read the book.[/size] 😆

y va marquer

If a person's sense of who they are and their sense of worth is bound up with being a member of a group then they are very likely to fear and act out on anyone who is not in that group.

In some cases the fact that they themselves may have suffered for being of that group, only re-enforces the antipathy towards perceived outsiders.

y va marquer

Tony Montana wrote:
y va marquer wrote:
It's a question I have never asked myself.
It doesn't mean anything at all to me in terms of how I see, define or describe myself.
I don't associate any of my character, traits, habits with my being white.
Being white doesn't inspire any feelings of pride or superiority - if anything I would wish that people who aren't white would not hold my being white against me, not judge me for it or assume things about me because of it.

In general though there's a privilege you get because of your whiteness that non-whites don't get in the West. That's not your fault personally. Nor is it wrong that most people in the West are white.

However, the reality is your whiteness means standardness.

I agree.
I understand that being born in Ireland and being white was lucky.
I also understand that this is just a very recent privelage.
It wasn't always thus for Irish women and it certainly was not always this way for Irish people born Catholic.

Coombs

Tony Montana wrote:
In general though there's a privilege you get because of your whiteness that non-whites don't get in the West. That's not your fault personally. Nor is it wrong that most people in the West are white.

However, the reality is your whiteness means standardness.

I was going to say something like this Tony but in a much longer and more annoying way. Thanks for putting it so neatly. I only wanted to add that part of the privilege is not actually needing to think of your "race" as part of you who are. For some there is never an option.

arsedocmd

flobaba wrote:
Genuine question: What does it mean to be white?

Bums here would know nothing. I waded into stormfront to find you some answers ,my heart swells of my own sacrifice.

[size=medium][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]Proposition zero. A White person is a human being of solely Native European ancestry; or a human being who, if they have non-European antecedents, is nonetheless of a physical and genetic makeup that is within the range typical of people of solely European ancestry; or, the child of two Whites.[/font][/size]

[size=small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]Proposition one. A White Nationalist is a White person who is, by their actions and their voluntary public declaration, politically comitted to the welfare of Whites, and to their continuing survival as a distinct and reproductively isolated group of human beings.[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]
COMMENT: The vexed question of how much non-white blood to allow and where Europe ends can not be solved by a formula. We may nontheless reasonably hope that the term "the range typical of people of solely European ancestry" shall have a more precise scientific definition in future than we can offer now.

((In fact the White race has never been a completely separate and distinct group in the past, but, paradoxically, may hope to be a separate and distinct group in the future.

In the end all Whites will be White Nationalists and every one else will be clearly non-white.))

Lawyers will make a mint over this. But every group that seeks to define itself faces this problem.[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]I don't define the white race by it's obscure ancestry. I define it as the present day ethnic boundaries created by skin tone and culture.[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]We all evolved from Eastern Africa. That is no secret that we are all of the same blood to begin with.[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]But what seperates us from the rest of the world is that we evolved farther than anyone else did. We are the furthest evolutionary step from our primate cousins of all of the 5 human "master races" (Caucasian, Sub-Saharan African, Middle Eastern, Indian, & Oriental).[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]I can see that you are a moderator, but your post borderlines on multicultural suggestive material. We can't doubt or lose our resolve and passion for our own people. We need to know where the line is drawn between "us" and "them."[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]It is what our entire cause is about. There is good and there is bad: there is white and there is non-white. [/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]It is superficial to a certain degree, but if you look at the general picture - all of the 5 major ethnic groups of Europe (Germanic/Aryan/Nordic, Celtic, Latin, Asiatic, and Slavic) and their descendants who have not mixed their blood outside of their larger race is white. Bottom line, we don't need to keep questioning who is white and who isn't - if he looks white, acts white, and has no obvious physical distinctions from being white - then he is white.[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]Period.[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]Aaron[/font][/size]

[size=x-small][font=verdana, geneva, lucida,]P.S. Rumors about certain mods, you in particular, have been circulating regarding a possible infiltration by non WN people or possibly even Anti-WN's. This seems to suggest that this is true. Please prove me wrong. What you wrote is purely anti everything about our cause. I was personally insulted that you, as a moderator and supposed leader, would write or suggest something like this that questions the integrity of our cause and our race.[/font][/size]

There's also Ann Coulter who distinguishes the protestant settlers who founded and developed the non native american inhabited land from the following rest of the immigrants etc etc.

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