UK Politics Omnishambles: Page 37 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

UK Politics Omnishambles

y va marquer

goon wrote:
In fairness didn't they both vote down each others resolutions on investigations? Both of which had strings attached.

Also the OPCW is going in to investigate anyway so the resolution is a little moot.

Precisely "[size=x-small][font=sans-serif]two expert teams" are being deployed to Syria later this week. [/font][/size]

[size=large][font=sans-serif]Tass reports on the White Helmets findings [/font][/size]

The Russian Defense Ministry stated that White Helmets were an unreliable source, notorious for disseminating falsehoods. The Russian center for the reconciliation of conflicting parties on April 9 examined Douma to find no traces of chemical weapons. Earlier, various official Russian agencies repeatedly warned that preparations had been underway in different parts of Syria for provocations and simulations of chemical attacks that would be blamed on government forces.

Mirth

Re: Salisbury.

The Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons agreed with the UK's findings on its identity of the nerve agent.: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43741140

jones

"Russian spy poisoning: Nerve agent inspectors back UK"

Highly suggestive header from the BBC when the OPCW merely confirms the identity of the nerve agent. The pressing question who did it (which they happily quote Johnson for) isn't touched upon in their dossier. Then again I'm not surprised after I've seen this earlier today 😆

Mirth

They literally say in the article that the agents were not charged with identifying the source. The title is the same as what's being run by the FT and Sky News.

The Corbyn thing was blown out of proportion as well, last week the BBC was criticised for showing footage of him playing with Russian dolls. If anything, it seems like the Momentum brigade are seizing on evidence of conspiracy to stop his approval from continuing to fall.

Klaus

From the report summary on OPCW's website: https://www.opcw.org/fileadmin/OPCW/S_series/2018/en/s-1612-2018_e_.pdf

10. The results of analysis by the OPCW designated laboratories of environmental and biomedical samples collected by the OPCW team confirm the findings of the United Kingdom relating to the identity of the toxic chemical that was used in Salisbury and severely injured three people.

The TAV team notes that the toxic chemical was of high purity. The latter is concluded from the almost complete absence of impurities.

It's nothing revolutionary, but some general conclusions can be drawn from this:

Agree that the BBC headline is misleading. The OPCW report does back the UK, but only to the extent that the technical analysis of the compound matches Porton Down's.
They do agree with the conclusion of the British findings even if they don't publicly identify the name and structure of the nerve agent. Which means that we can move on from people doubting the attack even happened on account of not understanding how a batch of Novichok failed to kill the victims. Testing is based on both blood samples and on-site collecting of evidence. This leaves no room for doubt.
The grading does lends credence to the claim that the compound was manufactured in a specific facility by someone who've had the necessary means and research to nail down and refine the process.

jones

Mirth wrote:
They literally say in the article that the agents were not charged with identifying the source. The title is the same as what's being run by the FT and Sky News.

Yes, in the penultimate paragraph right after they quote their BBC correspondent in saying this strengthens the case against Russia, while the header is literally claiming the OPCW is "backing" the UK - on a matter which nobody of note has even doubted. I don't think they could've been less subtle about it if they tried.

jones

I cant seem to find the article in English but the AFP yesterday (which is a press agency and not a news portal after all) published a piece claiming the OPCW confirmed the UK's claims about the Russian origin of the poison:

https://www.afp.com/de/nachrichten/59/opcw-bestaetigt-russische-herkunft-des-giftes-im-fall-skripal-doc-13y68j1

Not exactly surprising that would happen given the massive suggestions everywhere. I found an interesting media resonance piece which showed literally every newschannel bar one in Germany spread the word from the AFP, maybe Mirth this explains the scrutiny with which one should look at headers like the one from the BBC.

jones

Burnwinter wrote:
No hard feelings on my part. It's interesting to me that Mason is quoting such a source (as mentioned I was aware Bellingcat was discredited by anti-imps), not that I expect much better from him. But yeah from what I understand Higgins is basically a nerd who looks at pixels.

https://www.bellingcat.com/resources/articles/2015/01/20/social-media-and-conflict-zones-the-new-evidence-base-for-policymaking/

It's not exactly new but this article really did stoke my interest. Higgins is more or less openly putting his "analysis" on the market, this article basically reads like a pamphlet of his company to do live intelligence gathering with some faux authentic tag for policymakers to use. Again, I'd say fair play for seizing that type of "business" opportunity for someone who has likely never even left England, if it wasn't for the fact that he's stoking the flames of war with every horseshit "independent" assessment of who did what in a war zone where a myriad of parties fight along and even across enemy lines.

Qwiss

jones wrote:
Then again I'm not surprised after I've seen this earlier today 😆

Wasn't that a HIGNFY you joke though? Not that it isn't incredibly anti-Corbyn but still.

jones

Qwiss! wrote:
jones wrote:
Then again I'm not surprised after I've seen this earlier today 😆

Wasn't that a HIGNFY you joke though? Not that it isn't incredibly anti-Corbyn but still.

Do an image search of the picture and you can find the source of it. It's from Newsnight

Mirth

At this point they're both keeping each other in the job. 😆

jones

What's your main grief with Corbyn Mirth? I think I know you well enough to assume you're not a Tory but I see you slating Corbyn awfully often.

goon

He’s a dirty Blarite.

Mirth

jones wrote:
What's your main grief with Corbyn Mirth? I think I know you well enough to assume you're not a Tory but I see you slating Corbyn awfully often.

Think I had a similar discussion with Burnwinter: http://www.onemoreinthetolly.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=3331&pid=765647#pid765647 I echo goon's post there and I maintain what I said about Corbyn's message being all wrong. He's not as popular when he's not in campaign mode, much like most populists.

On top of everything else, I'm not comfortable with Momentum's involvement in all of this either. I only slate Corbyn since everyone already knows the current government is a rotting corpse and there's nothing more to be said about them whereas most people still think Corbyn is anti-Brexit...

I actually voted for Labour last year because, I mean, lesser of the two evils but usually I identify more strongly with Lib Dems.

Qwiss

jones wrote:
Do an image search of the picture and you can find the source of it. It's from Newsnight

Yep fair enough. HIGNFY portrayed the whole thing in a very different way. As I say they are very anti-Corbyn generally.

jones

Mirth wrote:
jones wrote:
What's your main grief with Corbyn Mirth? I think I know you well enough to assume you're not a Tory but I see you slating Corbyn awfully often.

Think I had a similar discussion with Burnwinter: http://www.onemoreinthetolly.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=3331&pid=765647#pid765647 I echo goon's post there and I maintain what I said about Corbyn's message being all wrong. He's not as popular when he's not in campaign mode, much like most populists.

On top of everything else, I'm not comfortable with Momentum's involvement in all of this either. I only slate Corbyn since everyone already knows the current government is a rotting corpse and there's nothing more to be said about them whereas most people still think Corbyn is anti-Brexit...

I actually voted for Labour last year because, I mean, lesser of the two evils but usually I identify more strongly with Lib Dems.

Yeah I remember that post but it's mostly attacking the packaging and perception not Corbyns message if I'm not missing anything.

I can fully understand Corbyns (non-)position on Brexit. The bloodthirsty masses demand a clear direction in terms of being pro or against it but there's absolutely no winning there whatever you pick. The European Union is and always has been a fundamentally neoliberal institution and looking at the direction it'll take in the next few years with ambitions like the growth and stability pact for Europe (think troika type of instructions dictated to any and every member state falling foul of German austerity rules) and a EU regular military he'd be hard pressed to rally for Remain. At the same time among other obvious reasons if theres an argument and you see Boris Johnson next to you chances are you're wrong

Qwiss

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/only-british-passport-holders-can-apply-for-brexit-border-force-jobs-in-belfast-36810389.html

So only Northern Irish people with British passports and who have a "special allegiance to the Crown" will be allowed to work on the border posts post-Brexit. That seems quite like a return to the bad old days.

Bold Tone

I should be amazed all this has been taking place for almost a decade but i'm not.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43726976

Coombs

Spiteful, crass, inefficient, and embarrassing.

Bold Tone

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