News Thread 2015: Page 174 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

News Thread 2015

Meatwad

Biggus

Tony Montana wrote:
Qwiss! wrote:
If Muslim immigrants are provided equal opportunity to British (or any other European nations) citizens then I do believe that in 50 years they would very likely have moved into a much more liberal position. Education and prosperity are great weapons against backwards religious ideology. Christianity is just as backward as Islam its just that there are less strict Christians in Europe than there were 50 years ago.

What is backwards about Christianity or Islam qs?

Irishgunner

😆

Kel Varnsen

Burnwinter wrote:
Kel Varnsen wrote:
So it's a problem, but not a big problem?

You're comparing the wrong alternatives—which as I discussed, occurs as a result of your frame of reference.

Maybe, but we can talk about the severity and cause of the issue later. Is it a problem that a large percentage of western muslims hold these beliefs? It's a simple question.

Bold Tone

No it is not. Simple answer.

Qwiss

Tony Montana wrote:
Qwiss! wrote:
If Muslim immigrants are provided equal opportunity to British (or any other European nations) citizens then I do believe that in 50 years they would very likely have moved into a much more liberal position. Education and prosperity are great weapons against backwards religious ideology. Christianity is just as backward as Islam its just that there are less strict Christians in Europe than there were 50 years ago.

What is backwards about Christianity or Islam qs?

That they are based on books from around 2000 and 1400 years ago. That they reflect their times when it comes to things like misogyny, homophobia, corporal punishment, etc That they both state all other religions are wrong means they are in direct conflict with each other. That people allow the idea of a supernatural being they have never witnessed to guide their choices in the hope of reward when they are dead. Thats all backwards.

Bold Tone

These books say some geezer walked on water.
That is enough.

Rex

What Qs says is all true but, to make matters even worse, believers pick and choose which parts of holy scriptures to adhere to and which to ignore at their convenience.

Bold Tone

True and this, also, relates to Kel's question.
I know for a fact that many muslims miss a lot of the set prayer times but if some pollster asked them or they had to fill in a questionnaire, they would, religiously, answer 5 times a day.

Kel Varnsen

Bold Tone wrote:
No it is not. Simple answer.

Due to the nature of the subject or the predicate?

Bold Tone

Nothing to do with assertion.
It is a straightforward answer to a direct question.

Kel Varnsen

Bold Tone wrote:
Nothing to do with assertion.
It is a straightforward answer to a direct question.

I don't think you understood the question. You say that it's not a problem that muslims hold these beliefs. Is that because it's not a problem that muslims hold these beliefs or that it's not a problem for anyone to hold these beliefs (i.e. it's perfectly ok to hold these beliefs for anyone)?

Bold Tone

I did understand it and my answer was a simple version of the many you have received from all and sundry.

Kel Varnsen

Bold Tone wrote:
I did understand it and my answer was a simple version of the many you have received from all and sundry.

Then why can't you answer my follow up question. Is is unproblematic that western muslims hold these beliefs or is it unproblematic in general to hold these beliefs?

Burnwinter

Kel Varnsen wrote:
Is it a problem that a large percentage of western muslims hold these beliefs? It's a simple question.

It's not a simple question. I have to ask relative to what, because you wouldn't be asking others to evaluate some survey's claims about Muslims if you weren't about to set out some speculation with which I presume from long experience I'd disagree.

Is this how the conversation plays out in your mind?

VARNSEN: This thoroughly reputable survey proves Muslims believe horrible things.
BURNWINTER: As a regressive leftist, I am naturally inclined to excuse all bad people corrupted from birth by evil ideologies of everything, due to my inconquerable self-loathing.
VARNSEN: Please do continue to hate yourself—but before you do, do you think the survey is true?
BURNWINTER: I'm not so sure.
VARNSEN: Let me relax my requirements: if the survey were true, would its results present a problem?
BURNWINTER: The apparently minimal demands of your stripped back hypothetical upon my conscience have allowed me to accept that the results would, in fact, be problematic.
VARNSEN: And if there were a problem, should we not, rationally, [wildly xenophobic policy proposal]
BURNWINTER: Hypothetically … your logic is unshakeable.
VARNSEN: Well, let me tell you something. The Pew Research Centre itself agrees with the survey's conclusions!
BURNWINTER: I am converted. Take me to the Warm and Cuddly Euro-Supremacist Border Control Party's enrolments desk!

And there is no "severity and cause of the issue", because there is not one issue. There is no "Muslim Question" to debate.

flobaba

Lol Burns, idiot!

Burnwinter

I am a moron, of that there should be no doubt.

Rex

😆 That is top kwalitee, Burnsy. 🙂

Bold Tone

Kel Varnsen wrote:
Bold Tone wrote:
I did understand it and my answer was a simple version of the many you have received from all and sundry.

Then why can't you answer my follow up question. Is is unproblematic that western muslims hold these beliefs or is it unproblematic in general to hold these beliefs?

You mean like this guy who is in the running to be the head of the Western world.

Kel Varnsen

Burnwinter wrote:
Kel Varnsen wrote:
Is it a problem that a large percentage of western muslims hold these beliefs? It's a simple question.

It's not a simple question. I have to ask relative to what,

It is a simple question based on simple predicate logic. You can assess it relative to whatever criteria you find relevant and important.

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