Former Arsenal Players Thread: Page 101 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Former Arsenal Players Thread

QuincyAbeyie

Burnwinter Just fractions of that lineup made mincemeat of European giants.

Did they though? Honest question, not having a dig. It's just that from an "outsider" perspective, it's hard to not see the CL performances of that team as a blemish when compared to the very best.

I guess for someone who became an Arsenal supporter in 2006, it's hard to appreciate that generation in the same way you do. If I see a different team than Arsenal today that dominates their own league but goes out during the group stage or quarter final of the CL every year, I think it'd be hard see them as one of the best teams in the world, and at the very least in a historical perspective.

Claudius

QuincyAbeyie you’re absolutely right. We have a pitiful European record for a club our side. We are easily the third best team domestically, but that hasn’t translated continentally. This 14 year stretch without a champions league quarter final, for example, is poor. And it is something we need to stay laser focused on remedying. Because it always creates a “but” about Arsenal when analysts discuss great teams. It’s the stick that wicked rival fans beat us with.

RocktheCasbah

QuincyAbeyie it's not an unfair question. I think, relative to Arsenal's domestic achievements in my lifetime, our European record is essentially pathetic. But I also have to acknowledge that had a few sliding doors moments (Nayim, Keown missing an open goal from two yards v Galatasary, WAYNE FUCKING BRIDGE, more than anything that Lehmann red card), gone the other way, things could be much different.

daredevil

QuincyAbeyie

When we entered the CL after winning the Double in 98, our home record at Wembley was terrible. We went back to Highbury and we experienced a significant improvement in results, but our away form remained incredibly poor which often was the cause of our exits. Away defeats at Valencia x 2, Bayern and Juventus saw us exit, when we were at our best. Only Chelsea knocked us out at home.

We played too vertically, missed Bergkamp on the road and lacked patience in our game. We were never the best in Europe or were even genuine contenders. The furthest that team reached was the QF.

Burnwinter

RocktheCasbah But I also have to acknowledge that had a few sliding doors moments

Weird, thought I'd already posted a reply to @QuincyAbeyie along these lines.

I'll say it again, if you take @Clrnc's "pre 2007" team with its XI assumed to be in their Arsenal prime, it would be lethal in any era. The lack of ability on the ball in defence would make press resistance a problem, but it would be extremely difficult to contain going forward. There's no deficit of athleticism or physicality.

With six months' tutelage and physical preparation Arteta style, that whole side perhaps barring Rocastle (our right is too good), Pires, Adams and Seaman (no one's getting picked over Raya) would be either starting or knocking at the door for us today.

Raya
Sagna Campbell Saliba Cole
Rice
Ødegaard Vieira
Saka Bergkamp Henry

... mix and match.

Imagine as a defender feeling like you've got a duty to drift off Dennis Bergkamp of all people because Saka's got on the ball.

RocktheCasbah

I think we're talking about different things, but I just find it very difficult to look at our European record under Wenger, given the players he had at his disposal and feel anything other than a sense of massive underachievement. United won the Treble in 1999, Fergie's team talk (which so nearly went down in infamy) pre Bayern allegedly went, "You haven't got anything to worry about, this lot aren't anywhere near as good as Arsenal" And yet we never got close to doing anything like United did with that turn of the millennium team. Partly Bergkamp, partly Wembley, I know - but aren't these, at the end of the day, just excuses?

Don Pacifico

Lovely goal by ex-Gunner Stephy Mavididi against Chelsea today.

lorddulaarsenal

Trying to teach my 7 year old to be evasive when dribbling. Showed him footage of both Cazorla and Arshavin. Man they were exciting special players.

Claudius

lorddulaarsenal show him Odegaard. And show him a healthy ESR. One nice thing that ESR had was the ability to escape with either foot. Wish he can rediscover his best at some point.

Big Willie

Claudius Wish he can rediscover his best at some point.

He can only do that with gametime which he doesn't seem to be getting. ESR is one of the guys I'm really rooting for but slowly and surely I'm coming to the conclusion that he'd be better off elsewhere much as I'd hate to see him go, otherwise he'll end up being a bench warmer and stagnating like he's done over the last 2 seasons.

lorddulaarsenal

Both good at retaining possession Claude but in terms of wriggling away from and beating opponents Santi and Andy were tops.

Gervinho was also an elite dribbler. Mostly due to him being able to quickly shift his body weight mid move. Loved him

Don Pacifico

lorddulaarsenal Gervinho was also an elite dribbler. Mostly due to him being able to quickly shift his body weight mid move. Loved him

Absence really has made the heart grow fonder!

Gervinho was never good enough. A signing that typified the complete lack of ambition of the club in the latter stages of the Wenger era.

SimplyThePest

Don Pacifico Yeah, picking up Gervinho from Lille instead of Hazard was another reminder of our continued decline at the time...

Big Willie

Don Pacifico Gervinho was never good enough. A signing that typified the complete lack of ambition of the club in the latter stages of the Wenger era.

We missed out on Hazard and got this guy. He tried and didn't deserve the criticism he got for playing and being out of his depth though.

I remember his car either broke down or was out for some scheduled work in Cricklewood in an autoshop about 150m away from a cafe some friends and I used to frequent.

Some people realised who it was and went over but then you had some clowns taunting him telling him to "get the fuck out of our club" and other shit like that. Totally uncalled for by these bellends who claim to be supporters abusing one of our players (who's never disrespected the club) during his time off. This was 2013 or 2014 and was pretty much less than a couple months before he ended up leaving.

lorddulaarsenal

Don Pacifico not saying he was good enough - needed to finish with more conviction but he was definitely one of the best at being able to get past defenders

daredevil

Don Pacifico

It had nothing to do with ambition. You can't aspire your way to having more money to spend on transfer fees and wages.Wenger wanted Hazard. A blind man would have chosen Hazard over Gervinho.

We couldn't afford the best, so we had to sign inferior options. Signing Gervinho whilst Chelsea who had a bigger budget signed Hazard crystallised the different environments the two clubs were operating in.

Claudius

Big Willie he’s been largely injured over the last two seasons. Guy has only really been available since late fall. But yeah, a couple from ESR, Nketiah, Nelson etc will need to be recycled for healthy competition

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

lorddulaarsenal weirdly I liked his stint at CF for us. It was refreshing having someone with pace and agility when we were so used to and sick of Giroud.

Big Willie

Lobbing Schmeichal who was pretty much on his line. Pure 🤤

Get him to watch some Pires @lorddulaarsenal

JazzG

That 01/02 season Pires was something else, he came back and scored but he never hit those 01/02 heights.

Oh and that above clip is a hell of a lot more enjoyable with Andy Gray's commentary.

TambourineMan

Andy Gray adored Pires.

Lukazan

TambourineMan To be fair I always felt Andy Gray liked us in general. I miss his commentary honestly.

"Well I'm sorry boys but you cannnot back off Dennis Bergkamp and back off Dennis Bergkamp and expect to not get punished."

JazzG

Apologies for the lack of pixels!

Don Pacifico

daredevil as others have said, think this is dependent on whether or not you believe we had more cash available than we spent.

« Previous Page Next Page »