I can 'appreciate' him as a player, but can't say I've ever been a massive fan. Just something about him that I don't particularly like.

I think the bloke is brilliant but I'm not so sure about him and Ramsey in midfield.

Not for us. Think he's on the decline too

big fan but not what we need. he's not really a pivot midfielder, which is what i'd prefer in that position

I don't like Khedira-Ramsey either.

Whatever CM we buy (if we buy) has to be able to cover Ramsey's position as well. We have no natural backup for him and that killed us last year. Wilshere can't play there, Flamini-Arteta is a subpar pairing. Khedira's not leaving Madrid to be Ramsey backup of course.

We aren't buying Khedira for fuck sakes. Real and ancelotti have no intention of letting him go.

Ancelotti rushed Khedira back into the team post recovery, doesn't exactly strike me as a played who is surplus to requirements.

evoh wrote:

Ancelotti rushed Khedira back into the team post recovery, doesn't exactly strike me as a played who is surplus to requirements.

Think that had a lot to do with Alonso's suspension.

Illaramendi has been disappointing, so they had to rush Khedira.

Khedira is the Real player most likely to be sold, ask any Madrid fan.

The Madrid fans have made Khedira a scapegoat for some reason. If Illaramendi wasn't absolute turd I'd be convinced they were selling Khedira this summer. However, Xabi Alonso is well past it, Illara is turd, and Casemiro is turd on a stick. Keeping Khedira would be the smart move for them.

He's not turd

He's probably better than those Bilbao lads you want us to sign

Khedira can't really play that pivot role though. Illarra is young and will get one more season to prove himself.

We don't need a "pivot" or a "destroyer" or any other nonsense position that is no longer relevant in the modern game. We need two excellent midfielders with the works to play behind or in front of a playmaker. Obviously Ozil is here so they'll play behind one. Basically the inverse of Italy and France's respective midfields.

Khedira/Ramsey would be great.
Matuidi/Ramsey would be great.
Pogba/Ramsey would be great.
Schneiderlin/Ramsey would be good/great.

Pivots are absolutely relevant in the modern game. Barca and Real both use one. Bayern use one when Lahm plays there. It's very difficult to do anything besides play a designated holder when Ramsey and Ozil are the other midfield players in the center of the field. The first three pairings you mentioned would not work well at all.

Pivot position not relevant in the modern game? Tell that to Spain and Barca.

All you need to do is mark the pivot player and bam, team falls apart. Instead, you need a playmaker who can play up by the striker or behind two all-around CMs or out wide. Ozil can do that, Isco can do that, Oscar can do that, etc.

Of the teams you mentioned, only Barca plays with a real pivot, and not really to great effect anymore. Guess you could make a case for Lahm and Bayern but what they do is not in any way the classic pivote.

At Real, for instance, Xabi Alonso and Modric are box to box with one being less adventurous in the final third, just like Khedira could be for us, with Isco playing ahead of them or dropping behind one of them if necessary (or pushing out to the wing, etc.).

A player who screens the back four also needs to be the outlet through which the team can play when the ball is with the CBs, if that player "sits" like so many want, like the classic pivote, then he's easily marked out of the game and the team is forced to play through their fullbacks. This is not good. Just look at Spain and Italy recently. France played both games with 2 all-around B2B midfielders and Cabaye as a playmaker. Time after time, Cabaye was up the pitch ahead of his CMs, and the CMs actually took it in turns pushing out wide (even overlapping with the fullbacks!) so the wingers could cut inside. Nobody just "sat" or played any kind of traditional "pivote" position.

Ramsey - Khedira would be a remarkable midfield. And more likely suited to Wenger than, say, a dedicated DM. Wenger hasn't had one of those since he denied Gilberto the captaincy he deserved. Don't see that changing. We still have Flamini to do his tough-tackling, half marathon-running, pointy/shouty act as necessary

Rather matuidi